Questions Muslims cannot answer about Jesus; and Truths that they cannot refute

This was in response to a post by a Muslim where he put up a video by Daniel Kirk, a professor, who was released from Fuller Seminary because it seems he thinks homosexuality is ok and that the Synoptic Gospels do not teach that Jesus is Deity, and then further discussion.

The Muslim asks why Jesus did not worship Himself; and also to base one’s understanding of Jesus on His actions and words. (see the com box)

My response:

The substance / essence / nature (ذات ، جوهر ) of the Father, the Son, and the Spirit are the same essence, so to worship one of them is to worship all three persons of the Trinity, Trinitas Unitas. (3 in one)
Jesus accepted worship; He never refused it, so He was and is Deity.
Matthew 2:1-12
Matthew 14:33
John 20:28
Matthew 28:9
John 5:23

John 9:38
Hebrews 1:6, 8 – commands to worship the Son, and the throne of God is the Son’s forever, “But of the Son, it says, “Thy Throne O God is forever”
Revelation 5:8-14

Also, Jesus’ holy and pious character points to His Deity.
He never sinned. John 8:46; John 19:4
Even the Qur’an confesses this – Surah 19:19

Jesus predicted His death and resurrection at least 3 times before it happened.(Mark 8:31; 9:31; 10:32-33; also John 2:19-22)
Jesus rose from the dead. (Matthew 27; Mark 16; Luke 24; John 20-21; I Corinthians 15)

What do you do with the empty tomb?
What do you do with the appearances of Jesus to His disciples?
What do you with Him showing them His body to touch and feel? (Luke 24:39; John 20:26-29)
Why were the Romans nor the Jews never able to find His body, if they or someone else had stolen it?

Why would the disciples preach His death and resurrection with boldness and get persecuted for it if they had secretly stolen it? (Acts chapters 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9 and more)

Jesus never conquered anybody, never entered into politics, and never fought back or did violence to anyone. (He rebuked the hypocrites and Pharisees, and overturned the tables in the temple full of the money-changers, etc. – but that was justice.)
Jesus loved people, the lepers, the poor, slaves, etc.
Jesus ministered to the outcast, like the Samaritan woman in John chapter 4, and the touched and healed the lepers in Luke 17.

The Roman Empire became Christian after over 300 years of the disciples of Jesus becoming the manifest, dominant ones – (as the Qur’an testifies – 3:55 فوق – above, dominant, victorious and 61:14 ظاهرین – the manifest and obvious ones), and growing and responding in a holy and godly manner, even as they were hunted down and persecuted and killed (off and on) as testified by early documents like the Didache, Mathetes, etc. and the early church fathers such as Clement of Rome, Ignatius, Polycarp, Justin Martyr, Irenaeus, Tertullian, Cyprian, Clement of Alexandria, Origen, Athanasius, etc.

That victory through humility is powerful. The victory of the cross and resurrection is powerful.

Addendum: (there are a couple of other exchanges I thought are pertinent here.)

This Muslim asked, and I elaborated more:

The question is why do you worship two extra persons that Jesus didn’t worship?

No, the question is why did Jesus receive worship and honor and claim to be God? ( all the “I am” statements and John 5:17-18; 8:24; 56-58; 10:30-39; 19:1-7)

In His incarnation, He prays to and honors the Father, and honors the Spirit as the one who is “the Spirit of Truth” and says “He will testify of Me”.

Neither did any of the OT prophets.

The Trinity was not fully revealed yet in the OT, even though there are hints of the doctrine.
“Let us make man in our image” – Genesis 1
Elohim is plural.
“The Spirit of Yahweh”, etc.

“kiss and worship the Son” – Psalm 2:2, 7, 11-12

Paul Williams, the Muslim who runs the blog, says that when Jesus calls Himself the Lord (kurios) of the Sabbath (Mark 2:28), he is not making a claim to being Yahweh Himself.  He says that since Jesus spoke in Aramaic, it doesn’t mean “Lord” as in Yahweh.

Daniel Kirk wrote:

In Matthew, Mark, and Luke, Jesus says very few things that explicitly claim lordship for himself, . . .

Oh, except claiming He is Lord (Yahweh) of the Sabbath Day – Mark 2:28, which is a claim to be God Almighty of Genesis chapters 1-2, the creator of all things who created in 6 days and then rested on the 7th day.

oops.

oops . . . Mark 2:1-10 shows Jesus is God by being able to forgive sins . . . oops. The Scribes admitted this, “Who can forgive sins but God alone?” (Mark 2:7)

oops.

and many more passages where Matthew, Mark, and Luke call Jesus “Lord” ( kurios) = Yahweh, Master, Lord of lords.

oops

Matthew 7:21-23 –
Lord, Lord” = about Jesus on the day of judgment. (“on that day”)

oops

In context, since the Pharisees were objecting to Jesus’ disciples working on the Sabbath Day, the claim of Jesus is a claim of Deity. (Mark 2:28 and surrounding context.)

And Jesus as “Son of Man” – He is claiming to be the Divine figure of Daniel 7:13-14 who goes up to the ancient of Days and sits down at His right hand. (ascends to heaven and sits at the right hand of God the Father) and is given a kingdom of people from all nations and they come and worship Him. Mark 14:60-64 – that is why the Jewish leaders accuse Him of blasphemy and call for His death. It is clear.

Yes, Jesus spoke orally in Aramaic, but the gospel writers wrote it in Koine Greek, so that it would go out to all the nations living in the Roman Empire at the time, in a language that more peoples could understand and it was written down so that we would have it later in history to read, study, and understand. Psalm 110:1 used 2 Hebrew words for “Lord”, but they are both translated in Greek as Kurios, (in both Lxx and all three Synoptics, another example where Ehrman and you are wrong)

εἶπεν ὁ κύριος τῷ κυρίῳ μου κάθου ἐκ δεξιῶν μου

“The Lord said to My Lord sit at My right hand”

נְאֻם יְהוָה לַֽאדֹנִי שֵׁב לִֽימִינִי

Yahweh and Adoni – shows that Jesus is Yahweh. (Matthew 22:41-46; Mark 12:35-37; Luke 20:41-44)

That all three synoptics translate the passage this way shows that all three of them understand Jesus’ claims to be God; and again, Ehrman is proved wrong, as is Daniel Kirk, and you.

Mark many times does keep the Aramaic in the text:
Mark 3:17; 5:41; 7:11, 34; 14:36; 15:22, 15:34 and translates it into Greek.

I wonder why Mark does NOT do that for Lord in Mark 12:35-37 ?

About Ken Temple

I am a follower of Jesus Christ. I am a sinner who has been saved by the grace of God alone (Ephesians 2:8-9), through faith alone (Galatians 2:16; Romans 3:28; 4:1-16), in Christ alone (John 14:6). But a true faith does not stay alone, it should result in change, fruit, good works, and deeper levels of repentance and hatred of my own sins of selfishness and pride. I am not better than you! I still make mistakes and sin, but the Lord is working on me, conforming me to His character. (Romans 8:28-29; 2 Corinthians 3:16-18) When I do sin, I hate the sin as it is an affront to God, and seek His forgiveness in repentance. (Mark 1:15; 2 Corinthians 7:7-10; Colossians 3:5-16 ) Praise God for His love for sinners (Romans 5:8), shown by the voluntary coming of Christ and His freely laying down His life for us (John 10:18), becoming flesh/human (John 1:1-5; 1:14; Philippians 2:5-8), dying for sins of people from all nations, tribes, and cultures (Revelation 5:9), on the cross, in history, rising from the dead (Romans 10:9-10; Matthew 28, Mark 16:1-8; Luke 24; John 20-21; 1 Corinthians chapter 15). His resurrection from the dead proved that Jesus is the Messiah, the eternal Son of God, the word of God from eternity past; and that He was all the gospels say He was and that He is truth and the life and the way to salvation. (John 14:6)
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3 Responses to Questions Muslims cannot answer about Jesus; and Truths that they cannot refute

  1. θ says:

    “Madmanna says: Why would the disciples preach His death and resurrection with boldness and get persecuted for it if they had secretly stolen it? (Acts chapters 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9 and more)”

    Different than Ebionites (Christ-believing Jews), the early Christian Gentiles got persecuted by both Jews and the Romans. It proved that the so-called Pauline Christianity was not a dominant religion for about 300 years.

    Nevertheless, the less number of decimation of early Christian martyrs (less than 5,000 total) before is too shameful to mention if we compare with a higher number of death of Jewish martyrs (total 580,000) for their mistaken belief in Bar Kochba’s status as Messiah, along with a greater irony how the surviving Jews refused Bar Kochba after his defeat.

    The suffering of early Christians is a proof that they were crushed a lot by Jews. Ebionites who followed both Jesus and Moses’ Law were spared by Jews and the Romans. After Bar Kochba Revoly, Ebionites become dominant above Jews and Christians.
    (i) According to the eye witness, such as Justin Martyr, Jews decimated Christians during Bar Kochba Revolt (132-136 AD).
    Justin, Apology, 13
    They are also in the possession of all Jews throughout the world; but they, though they read, do not understand what is said, but count us foes and enemies; and, like yourselves, they kill and punish us whenever they have the power, as you can well believe. For in the Jewish war which lately raged, Barchochebas, the leader of the revolt of the Jews, gave orders that Christians alone should be led to cruel punishments, unless they would deny Jesus Christ and utter blasphemy.

    (ii) Christians continued to be decimated by the Romans:
    Suetonius, Nero, 16
    Punishment was inflicted on the Christians, a class of men given to a new and mischievous superstition. He put an end to the diversions of the chariot drivers, who from immunity of long standing claimed the right of ranging at large and amusing themselves by cheating and robbing the people.

    //en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Damnatio_ad_bestias
    According to Roman laws, Christians were:
    -Guilty of high treason (majestatis rei)
    -For their worship Christians gathered in secret and at night, making unlawful assembly, and participation in such collegium illicitum or coetus nocturni was equated with a riot.
    -For their refusal to honor images of the emperor by libations and incense
    -Dissenters from the state gods (άθεοι, sacrilegi)
    -Followers of magic prohibited by law (magi, malefici)
    -Confessors of a religion unauthorized by the law (religio nova, peregrina et illicita), according to the Twelve Tables).
    The spread of the practice of throwing Christians to beasts was reflected by the Christian writer Tertullian (2nd century). He states that the general public blamed Christians for any general misfortune and after natural disasters would cry “Away with them to the lions!” This is the only reference from contemporaries mentioning Christians being thrown specifically to lions. Tertullian also wrote that Christians started avoiding theaters and circuses, which were associated with the place of their torture.[32] “The Passion of St. Perpetua, St. Felicitas, and their Companions”, a text which purports to be an eyewitness account of a group of Christians condemned to damnatio ad bestias at Carthage in 203, states that the men were required to dress in the robes of a priest of the Roman god Saturn, the women as priestesses of Ceres and were shown to the crowd as such. The men and women were brought back out in separate groups and first the men, then the women, exposed to a variety of wild beasts. The victims were chained to poles or elevated platforms. Those who survived the first animal attacks were either brought back out for further exposure to the beasts or executed in public by a gladiator.[33]

    Under Diocletian and Galerius
    //en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Christians_martyred_during_the_reign_of_Diocletian
    The reign of the emperor Diocletian (284−305) marked the final widespread persecution of Christians in the Roman Empire. The most intense period of violence came after Diocletian issued an edict in 303 more strictly enforcing adherence to the traditional religious practices of Rome in conjunction with Imperial cult. Modern historians estimate that during this period, known as the Diocletianic or Great Persecution and extending several years beyond the reign of Diocletian, as many as 3,000−3,500 Christians were executed under the authority of Imperial edicts.[1]
    The church historian Eusebius, a Bishop of Caesarea who lived through both the “Little Peace” of the Church and the Great Persecution, is a major source for identifying Christian martyrs in this period. Martyr narratives flourished later as a genre of Christian literature, but are not contemporary with the persecutions and are often of dubious historicity.

    (iii) Punishment on Jews by the Romans.
    – Christ of Rome.
    In one reference to Christ, a Roman historian shockingly reported that Christ (Chrestus) pressured the Romans to expel Jews from the city of Rome. Has Jesus traveled to Rome?
    Suetonius, Claudius, 25
    Since the Jews constantly made disturbances at the instigation of Chrestus, he expelled them from Rome.”

    – The Romans decimated Jews:
    Jews believed in the Messianic status of Bar Kochba, and they proved their faith for so by sacrificing their life in Bar-Kochba Revolt. As result of their “faith”, total 580,000 Jews were killed, 50 fortified towns and 985 villages were rased down by the Romans, and many more Jews died of famine and diseases.
    Cassius Dio, Roman History, Epitome of Book LXIX
    14 1 Fifty of their most important outposts and nine hundred and eighty-five of their most famous villages were razed to the ground. Five hundred and eighty thousand men were slain in the various raids and battles, and the number of those that perished by famine, disease and fire was past finding out. 2 Thus nearly the whole of Judaea was made desolate, a result of which the people had had forewarning before the war. For the tomb of Solomon, which the Jews regard as an object of veneration, fell to pieces of itself and collapsed, and many wolves and hyenas rushed howling into their cities.

    • Ken Temple says:

      Madmanna ?

      I wish that you knew how to write and communicate better. As usual, your posts are difficult to follow. Just throwing out unrelated sentences without any connections or explanations of the relationship to the sentences is difficult to understand your argumentation.

      The Ebionites did not become the dominant / victorious ones. (Surah 3:55; 61:14) They were a small group that eventually died out completely. Peter, James, John were not Ebionites or proto-Ebionites. Crazy theory, without any evidence.

      You quoted from Justin Martyr (around 150 AD) – he is one of the proofs of New Testament Christianity, which you call “Pauline Christianity”. There are many problems with your theory, but clearly Peter agrees with Paul in Acts 15:9-11 – “cleansing their hearts by faith” = “justification by faith alone”. James also agreed, by quoting from Amos and what he said in Acts 15. Also Galatians 2:7-9 proves this.

      Also, this destroys the whole “Muslim-Ebionite” theory:
      https://apologeticsandagape.wordpress.com/2011/08/05/desperate-and-dubious-muslim-apologetic-methods/

      • θ says:

        “Ken Temple says: The Ebionites did not become the dominant / victorious ones. (Surah 3:55; 61:14) They were a small group that eventually died out completely. Peter, James, John were not Ebionites or proto-Ebionites. Crazy theory, without any evidence.”

        Died out by what?
        Historians have a stronger proof than the Christian apologists on the Ebionites survival until 1,000 AD, even till 12th century in Arabia.
        Shlomo Pines (1966) in The Jewish Christians Of The Early Centuries Of Christianity According To A New Source (Proceedings of the Israel Academy of Sciences and Humanities II, No. 13) cited the records of a historian Abd al-Jabbar ibn Ahmad around the year 1000 AD on the Ebionites.
        //en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ebionites
        Some scholars argue that the Ebionites survived much longer and identify them with a sect encountered by the historian Abd al-Jabbar ibn Ahmad around the year 1000.[32]
        There is another possible reference to Ebionite communities, existing some time around the 11th century, in northwestern Arabia, in Sefer Ha’masaot, the “Book of the Travels” of Rabbi Benjamin of Tudela, a rabbi from Spain. These communities were located in two cities: Tayma and “Tilmas”,[33] possibly Sa`dah in Yemen.
        The 12th-century Muslim historian Muhammad al-Shahrastani mentions Jews living in nearby Medina and Hejaz who accepted Jesus as a prophetic figure and followed traditional Judaism, rejecting mainstream Christian views.[34] Some scholars argue that they contributed to the development of the Islamic view of Jesus due to exchanges of Ebionite remnants with the first Muslims.[13][35]

        “Ken Temple says: You quoted from Justin Martyr (around 150 AD) – he is one of the proofs of New Testament Christianity, which you call “Pauline Christianity”. There are many problems with your theory, but clearly Peter agrees with Paul in Acts 15:9-11 – “cleansing their hearts by faith” = “justification by faith alone”. James also agreed, by quoting from Amos and what he said in Acts 15. Also Galatians 2:7-9 proves this.”

        Early Christians who happened to have accepted deceits of Paul with his Pauline theology – including Justin, Paul and twelve disciples – all were killed, hence they are not the ones Jesus blessed with protection of “nothing shall by any means hurt you”, and “possess ye your souls”, “there shall not an hair of your head perish”.
        But the Ebionites were spared because they are the ones whom Jesus prophesied to be dominant and prosper. Also because they took heed of Jesus’ instructive fleeing and departing out (such as to Arabia).
        Lk 10:19
        Behold, I give unto you power to tread on serpents and scorpions, and over all the power of the enemy: and nothing shall by any means hurt you.
        Lk 21
        17 And ye shall be hated of all men for my name’s sake.18 But there shall not an hair of your head perish.19 In your patience possess ye your souls.20. And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh.21 Then let them which are in Judaea flee to the mountains; and let them which are in the midst of it depart out; and let not them that are in the countries enter thereinto.

        Eventually the early Christians wholly abandoned Paul alone after realising how much deceitful and wrong he was. Sin of Paul can be categorized as “Acta facientes” (made false acts to save their lives).
        By contradicting his own preaching in the temple, Paul was proved to be a cheap charlatan and evil impostor by accepting the Moses’ oral-traditions which James decided for him. Eventually, no one accompanied Paul, hence he was arrested and nearly lynched by Jewish mobs.
        2Tim 4:16
        At my first answer no man stood with me, but all men forsook me: I pray God that it may not be laid to their charge.
        Phil 4:15
        Now ye Philippians know also, that in the beginning of the gospel, when I departed from Macedonia, no church communicated with me as concerning giving and receiving, but ye only.

        //en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lapsi_(Christianity)
        Lapsi were classified into several groups:
        Sacrificati: Those who had actually offered a sacrifice to the idols. Christians that made sacrifices, especially to Roman gods, were only offered absolution on their deathbeds.
        Thurificati: Those who had burnt incense on the altar before the statues of the gods. From Latin thurificare – “burn incense”
        Libellatici: Those who had drawn up attestation (libellus), or had, by bribing the authorities, caused such certificates to be drawn up for them, representing them as having offered sacrifice, without, however, having actually done so. A two-year sanction was imposed as penance. From Latin libellus – “little book; letter; certificate”
        Acta facientes: Those that made false statements or other acts to save their lives. From Latin – “those doing the acts”
        Traditores: Those who gave up sacred scriptures, artifacts and/or revealed names of fellow Christians. From Latin tradere – “hand over; deliver; betray”

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